Thanks for a good class today. I think we spent most of our time laughing, but what's better than that?I will make some further responses to your blog posts about the movies and today's readings.
There will be no "老師" homework questions for Woman Warrior. Half of you will write "學生" questions for Tuesday's class on pages 1-108, and the other half will write questions for the 3/23 class on the remaining pages. (See today's e-mail.) We will then divide into groups and answer the best questions in class.
One further note... Sharon approached me after class with some additional thoughts about "Persimmons" and I told her she should make this the basis of her presentation (she will present on 3/23). So this shows you that your presentation can be about a new reading assignment, but also it could be a "return" to a recent assignment that you had something further to say about. The possibilities are pretty open, so let me know early if you have any ideas you want to explore.
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ReplyDeleteAs she seldom talks about herself, I wonder how Maxine Hong characterizes herself as a Chinese Women as well as an American?
ReplyDeleteIt's apparent that she tries to break away from the "Old Chinese" bondage and had fitted herself in part of the American culture. For several times she also admits that she's tried to turn herself "American-feminine." Her only channel to China remains in the memories of her mother's talk-stories. As we know, unless from a racial view, she has no physical connection with mainland China, so how does she identify herself as a Chinese?
Nonetheless, even when she expresses her relationship with America, which in the text p.108:
"And I think I belong there, where I don't
catch colds of use my hospitalization
insurance. Here (in the midst of her
mother's Chinese memories) I'm sick so
often, I can barely work."
She agrees with her mother that Americans are all "ghosts." She in fact views the "business-suited in their modern American executive guise, each boss two feet taller than I an and impossible to meet eye to eye" as enemies that are easily recognized. So does this mean that she would agree if someone said that she's following the "ghost" orders, as the way of how Robin in "My Kinsman, Major Molineux" eventually identifies himself with an unfamiliar crowd?
This is Tracy to ask a question.
ReplyDeleteReading Kingston’s“No Name Woman,”she expresses her imagination and the retold-story from her mother about her aunt in China. Among the whole story, Kingston not only describes the traditional woman character in China in her view but also develops her own ideas about her aunt. On the other hand, looking back in American Puritan tradition, it seems that woman’s position in two different cultural traditions have some similarities. Please compare and contrast the woman issue in Chinese cultural tradition with Puritan’s cultural tradition in, for example, Nathaniel Hawthorne’s works (for instance, The Scarlet Letter or The House of the Seven Gables).
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ReplyDeleteI think we probably can apply Dubois' "double-consciousness" here in Kingston's stories to answer Ted's question.(Can we?)
ReplyDeleteBoth old China and the current America are ghosts/burdens for the protagonist to meet/bear and the narrator herself stands somewhere in between.Or we can say that she was denialed(but somehow accepted??) by both old chinese and the americans. Anywaz, to me, Kingstons work is full of contradictions and displacement.
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ReplyDeleteSo far, I am trying to make out who the "Woman Warrior" is in this story? The girl, her aunt or actually the story-telling mother?
ReplyDeleteUsually people may think "warrior" is a strong word as to decribe "woman." I think "warrior" has some characteristics: strong, defensive, powerful, attacting, wounded...etc. What kinds of characters does Kingston want to imply through this word choice of "warrior" ?
These are good... keep them coming.
ReplyDeleteThis is Sydney.
ReplyDeleteI think Maxine Hong Kingston has chosen a special way to write the book, that she weaves some fiction into the reality.
Sometimes she seems to talk about her own background, her family; but suddenly I would find myself already on the way of exploring an imaginary story. This does confuse me when reading the book. It's hard to say where she begins the fiction and where she tells the truth.
I wonder why she applies this form in the book? Is it because she wants to create the mysterious atmosphere of the haunting ghosts which echos the book's subtitle? or any other explanation?
I find Maxine Hong Kingston's words easy to read, and I like the way she describes things. But after discussion, both Esther and I found that certain contents that she said(whether the ones that she claimed she heard, or observed, or even "imagined" for concluding or representing the situations back then ) in the novel aren't necessarily true.
ReplyDeleteI suppose Aaron had asked the students in California to read this book, since many of them are of Chinese background. I wonder if they had any thoughts about this? Or they perceived the past culture the same way as the author did? Does this type of book (Chinese American authors writing about Chinese culture this way) may have lead its non-Chinese readers to think the same way about Chinese culture?
Hi, this is Crystal
ReplyDeleteI found it interesting and amazing while reading the ghost stories told by the mother; the horrible attack by the Seating ghost in the midnight when she studied in medical school was the scariest part for me. There were diverse kinds of ghosts mentioned in the mother's stories such as the Desk ghost, Wall ghost etc., and the brave fighter, the story-telling mother, seemed to keep fighting against those "ghosts". Then, what is the real or further connotation concerning these terrifying ghosts? When the author claimed that her mother could even "eat" ghosts, did she merely apply that those ghosts represent the old and inflexible convention back in China that they kept escaping from?
When the whole family settled down in America, the mother also referred the real human beings there to "ghosts" as well, including White ghosts, Black ghosts etc. Does the "ghosts" here convey the same meaning?
In the stories, Maxine Hong Kingston talks a lot about the traditional “burdens” and “expectations” that Chinese women carry on their backs. How do the women in the novel (Kingston, her mysterious aunt, her mother, fantasized girl “Fa Mu Lan,” etc.) respond to these? What do they have in common and how are they different from one another?
ReplyDeleteThis Winnie!
ReplyDeleteIn the stories, Maxine Hong Kingston talks a lot about the traditional “burdens” and “expectations” that Chinese women carry on their backs. How do the women in the novel (Kingston, her mysterious aunt, her mother, fantasized girl “Fa Mu Lan,” etc.) respond to these? What do they have in common and how are they different from one another?
This is Tady and I want to ask why the mother tried to threat the author by the story of her aunt, which is half-imaginary and half-truth. The story may form a strong comparison in the author’s mind of how tradition the Chinese society was and how civilized Americans were, and may even make her hate Chinese culture.
ReplyDeleteThis ia Clara.
ReplyDeleteI believed that most of people are familiar with the tale of Fa Mu Lan. However, why did Kinston entirely distort the story instead of retell the legend in the first- person perspective ? What might those trails of white tigers, dragon, and snake mean since the author intentionally added them to the legend of Fa Mu Lan?
This is Vincent, and I'm interested in what the image and symbol Fa Mu Lan presents and represents to the author and her mother. I also wonder why the author's mother protray Fa Mu Lan's story to her. Does Fa Mu Lan represent the symbol which thrusts out of the frame and stereotype of Chinese traditions and rules imposing on women? I means does she create a brand new prototype of human beings or merely present another type of women who are embroidered or equipped with some tough(or male?) characteristics?
ReplyDeleteHi this is Ting Ju.
ReplyDeleteWhen I was reading Kinston's novel, I found that her "Chinese stories" are not like those stories that I've heard and her "China/Chinese people" are not the same as I've learned. Those Chinese-rooted things seem somewhat exotic to me. How do you feel about it? How the similarity/difference between reading and past experience can help us to know more about Kingston and her concepts?
When Maxine Hong's story comes about Chinese words she writes "the ideograph 'eight'" instead of using the actuall Chinese word "八" in her text. She didn't seem to be concerning about western readers' better understanding of the Chinese words. However Chinese culture is largely based on how and why words are made up.
ReplyDeleteI believe she was well educated in both Chinese and English though she was unfamiliar with China land, but according to my observation, was she really proud of Chinese culture? Because many of her description of Chinese culture are sarcasm to themselves. If so, aren't her self identification with Chinese exaggerated to you since she wasn't nourished a Chinese, or educated a Chinese?
Hong Kingston represents a story of an outcast as an analogy for herself, and both of them abide identity crisis confronting their family and the place where they were born and raised. But she resists from identifying herself with her aunt at the same time. I find it fascinating how her inner conflicts intertwined with her attempt to be Americanized and her fear not to meet the expectations of her family and the Chinese culture behind. I believe that her writing acts as a method to define her position; given the writing serves as a process approaching self-identification, does her conflict indicate the unavoidable loss and dilemma on the path toward the universal who-I-am question? Furthermore, would her process toward an identity being Chinese AND American, or being a combined one? I wonder how about the process for Hong Kingston’s parents in the foreign land, the States—have they gone through the same conflict like their daughter (probably without even noticing it?)
ReplyDeleteNames, to Hong Kingston, play critical symbols/ means for self-identity. To her aunt, deprival of her Chinese name from the family name hall alluded to her eternal departure from her Chinese origin. She is a woman with no name for sure, but how about someone having too many names? Like her niece, would Hong Kingston’s identity shift in terms of her two names in Chinese and English? Would her react under different cultures and philosophies in response to her different names? Do we the FLL students/ Pf. Winter identify us subtly—differently in Chinese and English names? (or would this be a silly question since we are eventually the same people after all?)
Also, Hong Kingston emphasizes the power relation between traditional Chinese men and Chinese women, and too the one between Chinese and Western men. Traditional Chinese men have been dominant over women; they set the rules. But while these Chinese men were into Western society, they turned in the submissive groups to their Western employers. I am interestingly confused about Hong Kingston’s stand to these power relations. Despite the author’s compassion on the taboos over women’s desire and long for happiness, Hong Kingston prefers to picture her aunt’s tragedy under the power possessed by one family instead of a woman’s tragedy under a patriarchal society, or a woman’s struggle for freedom against men-dominated culture/tradition. Dose her emphasis on the concept of a family intend to justify her seemingly-misogynistic Chinese culture for her American readers, or does she use it as a weapon against the old-fashioned rules for females?
This is a late Zoe, having many questions that's puzzlig her tiny brain.
ReplyDeleteThrough out the stories narrated by Kinston, she talks all about women and the views from women in building up a vision or a clue about Chinese tradition and culture in the old times which actually effected her concpets of Chinese culture. But it makes me feel that, hey, Kinston's doing all the talking, the stories she tells are seemly re-arranged and might be the version she made up herself. Frankly, I'm not convinced by the "women warriors" she builts up, it seems to me a little too narrow. Her intension of builting up the "ghostly" image of "women" as "warriors", however, attracts me and I wonder how it has become a tracing back on being a women warrior, how and why is she doing this?
Kinston talks about the stories standing as being an American who knows little but the stories her mother told in a spooky way(which I remember she put it that this was to make her stronger). Like what we discussed in "The Jazz Singer" does this make her more of an "American" by having the autority to make up these stories and talk about Chinese in a exotic way even if she claimed her bound with the tradition? Or something else was going on that I just couldn't figure out...
"Food" was mentioned in all three of the stories. I know that "food" acts a special place in Chinese culture, but in this book, Kinston has linked "food" into more of a symbolic meaning but I can't quite catch what her targets are. The meaning of "food" seems to be symbolic for many concepts that explains the situations these women wariors were struggled in. And the other thing that's maentioned in all stories is the "birth" that connect mother and child. In the cases we see here, it dealts with struggles that could be only found in Chinese culture, is this the way she wants to express the struggle she's going through as a new generation in America? Wasn't these "birth" bounded with the mother's identity that could not simply be erased.
And I don't know whether if it's my illusion or something that I have a akward time reading Kinston. Her lines seems to be organized in an unfailiar way, her thought-groups are strangely chopped in fast,rapid or hasty tone that I have to read a sentnce twice to understand her. Also the way she wanders or floats off into her extended imaginations, not to mention how symbolic it comes to, is surely unlike any other authors we have read. Does this thought of mine happens to be stranger than what I think I discovered? Or if I discovered a little truth in that, was it because of the audience she was facing that she make this exotic and much different writing.
This is Natalie who is going to post the conclusion of discussion our group made in the class.
ReplyDeleteGroup members: Natalie, Sherry, and Emmax
Question A: Does Hong Kingston identify herself as "Chinese"? Why or how?? How do you analyze her (non)presentation of the Mandarin ideographs?
We think Hong Kingston identifies herself as "Chinese", and followings are ideas to support our statement.
Her mother only tells stories when it is necessary; however, Hong Kingston mentions lots of Chinese tradition within the stories, such as bounding foot, the inferiority of women in China, the stories of 花木蘭 and 岳飛, which means that she contains background knowledge of Chinese tradition to some extent. Someone might argues that everyone can have background knowledge of Chinese tradition if s/he looks up some refernce books, just as Pond can write/translate the poem "The River Merchant's Wife". However, Pond's poem has lots of mistakes during translation since he does not 'really' get what Chinese tradition is. Hong Kingston, on the other hands, uses quite correct Chinese tradition to describe the stories. Moreover, she describes the stories in detail and with emotion of empathy and affection. She does that because they are the stories of 'her culture'; because they are the stories of 'her realtives and families', which compares to Pond whose poem "The River Merchant's Wife" has nothing to do with 'his culture'. That is to say, it is because Hong Kingston 'cares' since she is a Chinese so that she tries to describe those Chinese tradition as correct as possble, and tends to describe the stories with empathy, just as she is the characters in the stories.
Secondly, Hong Kingston uses 'subjective' imagination to desccribe the stories, such as in the story of "No Name Woman", she tries to figure out how would her aunt do under that circumstance (is it true that her aunt had an affair with other man in her village, or her aunt was raped was the truth?). It implies that she recognizes herself as 'Chinese' to tell the stories of her culture and her families. In other words, it is her recognization of being 'Chinese' so that she attempts to step in her aunt shoes to 'reconstuct' the history of what happened on her aunt.
Last but not least, even though Hong KIngston's mother tells her not to tell the story of suicide-auny, Hong Kingston still presents the event to readers by means of written words. It is because Hong Kingston tends to make a notion that the suicide-woman us a 'Chinese', and that woman is 'my' aunt who has blood relationship with me. That is to say, it is the story that links Hong Kingston's present and past which makes her think herself as a Chinese.
Here is the organized answer to in-class question J.
ReplyDeleteRea, Iris, and Qian Yu
In the No Name Woman, the family punished the drawn-in-the-well daughter by forgetting her name, eliminating her from the family line. In Chinese culture, this is the cruelest punishment a family can ever give. In old times, it surprises no one that a daughter who humiliates her family is forgotten by them deliberately.
Traditional Chinese values the concept of “family” as a whole; therefore, the surname that represents one’s blood is also vital. In our grandparents’ generation, wives would have to add their husbands’ surname in their names, for example, Lin Lin-Lin→Chen Lin Lin-Lin…kind of funny. Besides, women will only appear in their husbands’ family tree book with their original surnames but no given names. In other words, only male can inherit the family name (and the property). As a result, some wealthy but no-son family will ask men marry into their home, to produce male descendant in order to continue the family.
As for the naming, in old times, poor family would name their daughters without much consideration; some of the popular names even carried the meaning of “bring us a brother.” Wealthier family would ask the fortune teller to suggest names, according to old theories such as the five elements or the strokes of Chinese characters. Nowadays, the fortune teller still works. Many of our generation were named by the fortune teller, or named based on the theories. Another change is that in some “urbanized” family, women can now be included in the family tree book. Some of the old customs are preserved, while some are deserted.